6/18/2009

Here We Go Again...

Frankly I can't be the only one annoyed with all this talk about using English vs mother tongue for Science & Maths, right? I did an article about that previously. 

All this talk is starting to piss me off. Why? Apparently many Malaysians are freaking ignorant & plain DUMB. I sent a letter to the Star explaining my stand on this issue, so I'll put it here (I don't know if it'll be published but frankly, enough is enough):

"Hi I'm writing in response to the letter by CONCERNED CITIZEN on 18 June in the Star "What about English in Accountancy". My sister studied in form 6 arts stream, now she's studying accounting at a private university; although her major subjects were taught in Malay at form 6, she had no problem switching to English at the university level. This brings me to my point that the root of the problem is many young Malaysians these days aren't speaking enough English, hence the worry that they can't cope with the change in medium language. 
I believe that there are a few ways to go about this:
1. Make English a compulsory subject to pass at SPM. So it's estimated that 120000 candidates will fail SPM if this is made a policy. Enforcing this policy will ensure that less than 120000 candidates will fail SPM. If it is made compulsory, then the teachers & the students have NO CHOICE but to improve. 

2. I do think it is important to keep teaching Science & Maths in English. I'm now studying at a public university & the level of English proficiency there is EMBARRASSING. Either the students didn't put enough effort to be fluent in the language or they are too comfortable with their mother tongue. I see many students struggling to do well; understanding the question becomes a challenge. Sure there are some who do fine despite poor English fluency but they are the minority. We also know that many graduates fail to get a job because they stumble in the interview. This is something we have to correct & soon.

3. I know this will be answered with anger but I believe vernacular schools HAVE TO GO. Their very presence is SEGREGATION & it's impossible to unite young Malaysians from different backgrounds when this segregation starts early. In university, the Chinese mingle with the Chinese, the Indians with the Indians & so forth. Racism is evident in the way we pick our project team mates, the way we chat about issues etc. 

It's time to get things straight: get over our ignorance & accept that English is an important tool to succeed out there. We can teach Bahasa Malaysia & mother tongues as an additional language (we already have Bahasa Cina & Bahasa Tamil as SPM subjects), convert vernacular schools to national schools because National Service (PLKN) & tertiary education cannot ensure unity among Malaysian youth, & this is something we need to focus on."


What are the important points to consider when going through this issue?
1. Unity - we have to admit that right now Malaysia is a divided one; even people in my generation who are supposed to have "moved on" from racism are still being discriminatory & delusional about other races. We need to break this segregation & it has to start early so that Malaysian youth will grow up knowing what being a Malaysian REALLY means & to truly BECOME the 1Malaysia concept (which is a BS concept if we're still gonna see each other as Chinese, Indian, Malay etc)

2. Culture - before vernacular schools were introduced, mother tongue languages were taught in schools as a subject. Why can't we use that now? As I've mentioned, vernacular schools is segregation in practice. Even Chinese from Chinese vernacular schools have a chip on their shoulder when they confront Chinese from national schools. Why the huge FUSS about preserving their culture? I understand the whole pride & culture combo but when you risk putting your children through UNNECESSARY challenges in education, it's really not something worth fighting for. 

3. Language - let's face it: no one writes financial/legal documents in Mandarin or Tamil or Malay unless you're in China/India/Malaysia. Subjects such as science & math are already so established in English, it would be a fool who would insist different. What would learning these subjects require? UNDERSTANDING. You can only understand what you can read. If you can't read & understand your books (the concepts, the laws, etc), then you learn NOTHING. There's no way that Malay will somehow be the lingua franca of the world; same goes to Mandarin & Tamil. Try to understand that to go forward, you have to know the rules of the game & follow that. 

I bet some people will not like what I wrote but that's my opinion on things. If I have children, I rather them be bananas & do well in the future. I welcome comments & criticism.

91 comments:

Kn.L said...

Hi Rowan,

Have you heard about the One School campaign by demi negara ?

(http://deminegara.blogspot.com)

They have a petition signing here:-

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/kempen-satu-sekolah-untuk-semua.

Have a look at the petition site.

Thanks.

P/s: Heck! I want the government to take a serious look at our current education system. I signed the petition quite a while ago.

Rowan said...

Thank you for the link! Actually I didn't mention it but a single national school type is what we need. It's EXACTLY what we need! :) Thank you!

NJ said...

Salam Sejahtera Cik Rowan,

I was informed by a friend. I am one of the supporters of those who initiated this campaign.

Jadi saya ke sini untuk merakam setinggi-tinggi ucapan terima kasih saya kepada Cik Rowan kerana memberi sokongan terhadap SSS(Satu Sekolah Untuk Semua).

Marilah kita bersama-sama "contribute a little something" demi negara dan generasi kita yang akan datang.

Terima kasih sekali lagi Cik Rowan.

Salam.

"SATU BANGSA, SATU NEGARA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

Momoe said...

I'm with you on this too! :D hehe. Good points btw. Very well said.

NJ said...

and thanks so much to you too Momoe. Hope you lend your support by signing the petition too...

"SATU BANGSA, SATU NEGARA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

Rowan said...

@NJ: Thanks for the petition. This is the 1st step to getting rid of segregation. Next is to be Malaysian.

@Momoe: Thanks for your support, bro! :)

Auntie Florence said...

Hello Rowan,

I'm with you too on this. I don't want any segregation in our society. To sign the petition for the SSS is the first step. Txs for signing. Of course, me too, I signed. :)

Take care.

Anonymous said...

Now I know that I'm among friends here, where birds of a feather flock together. I better bookmark this site.

Hi all. Nice to know you.

San Peng

NJ said...

wow!

I feel so warm in here!

Thanks everybody! The blog Owner, Auntie Florence and San Peng!

"SATU BANGSA, SATU NEGARA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

Rwi Hau said...

i'm actually for the one school education system. in fact, i was actually a staunch supporter of such school, especially the once heavily criticized and scorned at VISION SCHOOL. everything changed when i saw no particular race in malaysia, especially the three major races of malaysia willing to tolerate and give in to juz one simple thing, EQUALITY. the fact is, this isn't something that's basically easy to implement. as much as i hate to say this, ONLY WHEN EQUALITY is promised for each of us MALAYSIANS regardless of race, religion etc. that there'll be no racial segregation. the one school campaign is none other than another political gimmick dispensed by the government. we hear a lot about the one malaysia policy haven't we? hence, this is juz another sell-off. unless EQUALITY is guaranteed, i dun think the One School Campaign can materialize.

Rowan said...

^Definitely what we want is a Malaysia free of segregation, where we're just Malaysians, not Chinese/Malay/Indian or Buddhist/Christian/Tamil/Muslim. Many things have to go before we can achieve that & the 1 School campaign is one of them. 1 step at a time. When everyone sees themselves as Malaysians & see no need for discrimination then only we can achieve zero segregation. It has to start young.

Rwi Hau said...

^how do you make sure no racial segregation take place? each of us is willing to make concessions. how do we get there? each ethnic sheds their doubts against other races. how do we reach that goal? EQUAL RIGHTS. finally, everything falls back on EQUALITY. if you look deeper into the recent USM's so called technical glitch on student admission, you'd know why i think EQUALITY is very important in ensuring peace and stability. i dun hate the One School campaign. i actually think it's a brilliant idea. i juz think there's one big obstacle that all of us need to overcome. the EQUAL RIGHTS issue.

NJ said...

Nothing will ever happen if no one take the courage to start anything.

Ask not what others can give to you, but what can you contribute and give to others?

Putting the condition, give me something first before I contribute anything, is quite a selfish attitude. This will never end, chicken or egg first?

"SATU BANGSA, SATU NEGARA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

Rwi Hau said...

^you see, this is where i beg to differ. we may not see eye to eye on this issue and this is definitely not a question of what comes first but whether or not individual rights can be upheld. if you can't even guarantee such a basic necessity, what am i supposed to be addressed here in malaysia? a second class citizen? or maybe a foreigner squatting around in malaysia?

you mentioned 'bout what i can contribute to the country. haven't i sacrificed enuf of what i have for the country when i had to give up my rights for someone else's happiness? is that called FAIR and EQUAL? i went thru a lot and trust me i've been thru it. you might not understand the real situation out there but you DEFINITELY WILL when that unfairness falls upon you.

Rwi Hau said...

another thing i wish to put forth here. i think there's one article that came out on the NST last month about chinese vernacular schools and why the chinese think these schools are important to them. it's a two way discussion between a malay scholar and a chinese scholar about the PPSMI. please, DO READ what has been discussed in the article before passing any judgment saying vernacular schools have to go. i was for the abolishment of these schools previously. but after careful consideration and having had discussed with those who went to chinese vernacular schools, i think it's really important to address this issue in a more logical approach. by simply abolishing these schools is not going to solve the pandemic segregation situation as the core, central issue does not lie on the existence of vernacular schools. if you really think this issue is as simple as signing the petition, then i'ma have to say you're totally wrong.

http://www.infernalramblings.com/articles/Malaysian_Education/152/ this is another article that might enthuse you guyz. even this guy johnleemk is asking to close down Malay Boarding Schools together with vernacular schools. hence, why aren't we hearing anything about the malay boarding schools being thrown into the limelight of abolishment? why make a fuss about vernacular schools only? don't they segregate according to races either? like i said before this, if we are truly ready to make any concessions, then there won't be a problem for us to reach that goal where the wealth of our country can be shared by all regardless of races.

please guyz, it's really not enough juz by reading. we have to get our ass out there and understand the situation.

i understand what the malays have in their mind cuz my five years of high school were spent mingling around with only my malay friends. i understand what the chinese have in their mind either cuz my pre-university and university years were spent with only my chinese friends.

i truly muz say here vernacular schools have stay, but with modifications. everyone has to make concessions.

NJ said...

Salam Sejahtera Cik Rowan,

With due respect to the blog owner, I think I shall not contribute turning this place into something out of topic any longer.

If anyone has anything to say to Ms. Rowan, about what she wrote in her blog article here, then by all means, address that to her. She will know her subject very well.

If anyone has a contribution to make toward the One School campaign, please visit deminegara.blogspot.com and address it there. Many references quoted there from laymen educationists to expert like Prof. Khoo etc which will make discussion more interesting and whole.

I just feel that it is not quite right to use the space provided here, even though with Ms. Rowan's permission, to question something not of hers in the first place. I dont think it is fair to make Ms. Rowan/her friends answer all queries regarding the One School when she just merely voiced her support for the campaign. And I also feel that, it is not fair not to let the deminegara know of any contribution that maybe of value to the campaign originally initiated by them.

I hope it is clear why I do not wish to engage further on the ONE SCHOOL topic here. Let's bring it to rightful place for further discussion and observe some respects for Ms. Rowan and her friends here.

Thank you.

"SATU BANGSA, SATU NEGARA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

Rowan said...

@NJ: No worries, the topic is still on going :)

@Rwi: What concessions/modifications would work?

Rwi Hau said...

erm, im sorry. i dun see what i've been pushing for is anyway out of topic. im merely addressing the real issue behind the reluctance of the non-malays in supporting the One School campaign. you see, nobody truly understands the situation, hence i dun think the One School campaign will materialize cuz we fail to engage and comprehend other people's plights. sorry to say this.

i wish to splurge what concessions and modifications that can be made here but since someone kinda hinted that this is outta topic, i guess i'd better not.

Anonymous said...

Hi Rowan,

Can I say something to Rwi Hau pls.

True there are other reasons causing segregation. But maybe we should not mix politic with the 1School thing.

They say they want the govenment to study the school system. Maybe let them. Then we know the real problems.

Rwi Hau said...

i thot it was all politics in the first place. it'd be a complete lie if you think this has nuthing to do at all with politics. i checked that DEMINEGARA blog out. that BIG KERIS pic aready symbolizes sth deleterious. i as a non-malay feel suspicious. if we truly wanna be called malaysian as a whole, ask urself what kind of an identity do we need to lump all of these races into? malay? chinese? or indian? or maybe orang asli? it's a compelete lie again if you think ur gonna tell other people that ur a proud bangsa malaysia without mentioning ur ethnic background. please, i'm a realistic person. such an idealistic idea won't materialize unless like i mentioned previously, we are READY TO MAKE CONCESSIONS!!!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

Mr Rwi Hau

Can I say I think from seeing keris photo only, cannot tell bad or good. People can have lion photo, tiger photo on blog.

I also read the blog. They say no politic. They want only govenment make a study. If expets make the study, then we know good or bad sek keb, sek jen keb, teachers and other things.

They say Malay, Chinese, Indians, Orang Asli all become Malaysian. I think it good, no more calling Malay, Chinese, Indian, Asli.

Anonymous said...

Dear all,

I am amused to see the correlation between Rwi Hau disagreement of one school for all and the equality concept he just highlighted.

I think should this one school for all is enacted, it will be good for the whole young generation. Reading the memorandum carefully, I feel that should this effort is successful, it WILL inmpose equality system to EVERYONE in the primary and secondary. Won't that be great?

Discrimination as it is now is subjective. If you say the chinese are discriminated in some ways, the malays feel it too (just ask any malay working in a chinese companies - shows that discrimination is everywhere and not limited to any race).

Do not forget, in every race, there are the rich, poor, the filthy rich, poverty, good samaritans, criminals, etc. So tell me can you see the logic behind this?

the logic is, our lil brothers and sisters study together and they will relate to one another better. As they grow up they will be more aware of what is happening in each other's culture spheres and its problems.

in the not too distant future, even the tertiary level can start imposing meritocracy since they experience it at primary and secondary levels.

when these kids become politicians, they will take this experience and amend/change the policies of this nation so that equality for all will come true (we all know that the NEP have a finite period of life - not to run forever, even now they are liberalising it)

that is why we need to support this one school for all. Because, IT SHOULD BE FOR ALL!

Equality will eventually come from this 1school concept. You cannot possibly ask for equality NOW when the people are segregated and polarised heavily in this lifetime. Thus, this is what the 1school concept is for. Thank you rowan for the opportunity to get things out of my chest :)

simpleton83

Anonymous said...

Dear Rwi Hau, in Malaysian Jata Negara, there are FIVE Keris in it. Do you feel suspicious about your own national emblem???

http://www.mot.gov.my/seyretfiles/localvideos/video_korporat/_thumbs/Jata%20Negara.png

hehehe

TQ

p.s. Luv your specs Rowan.. awesome frame lah.

Anonymous said...

The CPM Bintang Tiga took away two of my uncles. Very bitter.

I grew up staring at the rich gets richer and the poor stay poor. Very bitter.

This bitterness stops us from making sacrifices for the general and universal good.

I think I understand bro Rwi Hau's feelings. I have been there.

But then my parents made me realize why they made sacrificial gestures however small for the future of the youngs in the family.

I now feel it is ripe for me to pay my dues to them - by making my small bitter sacrifices for my grand-children and their children.

Sorry brother Rwi Hau, I have to take a different path than yours.

I have to do this for my grand-children and their children.

I think SSUS is the only safe road .. long and uphill maybe .. for young and yet to be born Malaysians.

They are in no position to make any choice for themselves now. Their fate can be said to be in our hands.

Thank you Miss Rowen. Your boyfriend is one hell of a lucky guy .. if you have one that is .. if not I would like to send in my application form .. heh heh.

Regards

San Peng.

Rwi Hau said...

heyo mr. anonymous. i dun think when u wanna bring unification into question that u shud be bringing the keris into picture. i juz dun think when u wanna promote smthg as big as this one school for all campaign, u'll need to bring the keris into picture. i dunno if anyone has heard about the keris brandishing by hishamuddin and how the practise is criticized by the non-malays. if u do not see anything suspicious to that, FINE!!! what race does the keris represent? the malaysian nation? why not the chinese lanterns? or maybe the dragon? come on. u said its subjective. HELL YEAH it is subjective. and u haven't answered the most critical issue of all. what kind of identity shud u lump all of these races into? if u say as malaysian in a whole, i bet u still aren't matured enuf. singapore is the best example to that. and tell me what kind of identity/culture/religion/language does a malaysian possess? does a malaysian speak in BM? or does a malaysian speak in mandarin? or maybe tamil as we speak? it juz doesn't make sense at all. i definitely know what's the reason for bringing the one school for all campaign into the limelight. the chinese in thailand, the phillipines and indonesia should be able to give u the answers. no matter what, u'll still have to revert to ur own ethnic background cuz ur facial features tell people another story. u can never hide ur own line of descent. for real, one school for all doesn't tell the true picture here. however, a standardized national syllabus is the real issue here. i dun think those supporting this campaign for the abolition of vernacular schools have tried to understand the most essential part of our nation building nor have they tried to understand why vernacular schools are that important to the non-malays. those in support of the one school for all mostly go or went to national schools so they dun get the picture. get one person from vernacular schools to speak up here. we'll see whether they want vernacular schools to be done away or be kept.

Rwi Hau said...

by the way, if we truly think that one school for all is where it all begins, i guess we shud be changing alot of stuff here ranging from the national emblem displaying the 5 'keris'es as u mentioned previously to sth that signifies all of the races of malaysia, or like you idealists people out there believe, a malaysian nation which i dun believe the malays would be willing to give in to. i said over and over again, if we are ready for CONCESSIONS, this dialogue won't be called an impasse.

and mr. anonymous. u remind me so much of the previous me, so belligerent, patriotic and supportive of whatever the government is dishing out. i guess the u haven't had ur share of being discriminated over and my best bet here is that u go out there and see for urself. if u think the malays are discriminated over by chinese companies, well i suggest u come over and let me show you what a government department could do to the non-malays. juz exactly how many non-malays do u get to see working as a government officer or are government servants?

Anonymous said...

Jeez, dissing the national emblem rwi hau? What has it done to u that made u angry at it?
Are u not malaysian? Did u not recite the rukunegara every monday morning at school?
Did u go to vernacular school? R u regretting the fact that u did not go to one a few years ago?
Why so much hate to the national symbols? It was there for a reason. It was created by our forefathers of this nation - malays, chinese, indians alike.
Too bad u think u r far better than the rest of them and the rest of us.

Chow n see u l8er..

Rwi Hau said...

hey there!! i guess u took it too far already. u haven't answered my questions and the one who's dissing someone else is u. im not disrespecting the national emblem. im juz giving u a knock up. did u not realize the situation that could take place if somehow virtuosos like u say the one school for all is the only thing that could unite us, to which i think it won't. somehow someway, i still dun see u guyz refuting or answering what i've put forth mr. anonymous cum righteous guy. if u believe so, why dun u answer my questions on what kind of identity should a malaysian nation be packing? again does a keris represent the whole of malaysia as a single nation? yeah rite.

u asked if i somehow regretted for not enrolling in a vernacular school. i would say YES!!! congratulations to u cuz u found one of the many people who are far much better off without people like u telling us what to do or believe in. i dun need a second thot to say YES. and i dun care what people like u think about chinese vernacular schools. and people like u who think vernacular schools are the reason for racial disharmony are those who think not for others but themselves cuz they never went to vernacular schools.

Rwi Hau said...

if you think national schools are that good, why would some malay and orang asli parents be willing to send their children to chinese vernacular schools? since you people say these schools are the source of racial disharmony, then why are there about 1-5% of malay and org asli students enrolling in this type of schools every year and the number keeps increasing? lame joke? i dun think so. 'bananas' like me could have said NO to vernacular schools a long time ago and keep on saying it over and over again. fact is, i was 100% against vernacular schools before this. what made me change my mind? talk to those who graduated from vernacular schools. you'd be able to get the picture. i was totally wrong to say that chinese vernacular schools had to go and be replaced by a single school. i was stark wrong cuz i never tried to understand why vernacular schools are that much important to the chinese. these schools are forever underfunded, and at many times do not receive financial aids from the government at all. hence, why are chinese businessmen willing to support this type of schools? asking urself won't give u the idea especially those who have no idea how vernacular schools operate. ask those studying in or those who've graduated from vernacular schools.

Rwi Hau said...

and heck yes i did. i recited the rukunegara every monday morning during my elementary and high school years. probably led to believe that everyone was equal under the malaysian constitution when i was actually wrong in all aspects. i believed i could obtain scholarships judging from my excellent results. or i believed i could at least secure a place in matriculation college even if my scholarship applications got turned down. and in the end what did i get? i ended up doing pre-university when most of my friends with worse results were in the UK, the states, indonesia, russian federation and australia. what now could be said? what do u call this mr. anonymous who knows it all? i was merely having a bad luck? or should i say, my future has been traded for someone else? what could be the reason? u and i both know the obvious reason to all of these misfortunes. and u know what i believe in now? if a single school system can guarantee equality in education and is free from the dirty politics the UMNO people are playing with, i'd definitely support it from the bottom of my heart. BUT WILL THAT HAPPEN? can u guarantee that it will happen? dun try to entertain me mr. anonymous. i was like u before. i know what u've got in ur mind.

Anonymous said...

wow.. someone just get up from wrong side of the bed... hihihi..

i thought this SSS is not about politics?

i can see the comment section took a turn for the worse when rwi hau came in..

it was civilised at first.. but rwi hau suddenly hate everyone else.

grrr.. i thought people like you should be more moderate than anyone else?

very disappointing... keeping away from freakazoids like you i must do.

all this rambling about national identity is superfluous. i think people should be free to practise watever culture they want.

but this SSS want BM to be the main language of all kids in school. if they wanna learn other languages, elective classes are provided.

with that regard, SSS is silent on the national identity @ culture. It is more moderate than the thailand of philiphine policy. Good lah in that case. If people are also opposing this mild SSS campaign, then I do not know what else to say...

if people who oppose this also do not have the solution as to what the national identity should be, then they should just keep their peace rather than incite hatred and writing rude comment smack of arrogance.

thanx.

p.s. I really dont see the logic in sending kids to vernacular schools. My cousins went to SRJK Tamil and he did poorly in exams.. why you shouted 'YES!" wishing you had studied in vernacular schools is beyond me. After receiving good education in national schools, you spat on it and claimed you should have been in vernacular schools.

You should learn from this guy who had 1st hand experience (this is where you lack - no experience in vernacular school) :

http://www.infernalramblings.com/articles/Malaysian_Education/3/

oh by the way, 25% student in vernacular school dropped out from it because of so many reasons. but perhaps you do not wanna discuss this aspect.

Rowan said...

A question: wouldn't implementing a 1 school system force the government to be responsible for ALL the schools under its wing PLUS garner support from society for their development? For example compare a Chinese businessman donating to a Chinese vernacular school to donating to a national school (under 1 school system). If he can do the latter, then he's not choosing race/skin color over the benefit of education.

It's a question, I appreciate honest answers :)

Auntie Florence said...

Haiya Rwi Hau,

Why so bitter lah? How can you talk about equality lah and what nots even before we start the SSS? Give SSS a chance mah...We need to have a proper and good direction in becoming a 'bangsa Malaysia'. This SSS is not a political thing, it is for our future generations ...don't you want to have your children, grand children etc mix around with other races from young ...Also lah, don't talk about other things yet mah ...like what Rowan says, one thing at a time ....slowly, slowly ...mah ...we are all into this ....give it a chance to move on ...btw our people can still take up Mandarin in schools what ....as it will be an elective subject fot those who need it ...btw hor, why are you promoting segregation? you don't want your future generation to be true Malaysians? Spirit Malaysian tak ada kah? No good lah like this, we are Malaysians what...why fight for something that belongs to another country's national language ....I want to say again, I support SSS, Rowan also ..do sign the SSS petition lah, Rwi..Take care.

Auntie Florence said...

Hello Rowan, you said,

"....If he can do the latter, then he's not choosing race/skin color over the benefit of education. "

Then that would be something, Rowan. I'm sure all races (especially non Chinese) will feel humbled by this Chineseman's generosity in donating to national schools (under a 1 school system). For me, it is a good sign for our race relation..

Anonymous said...

Rowan,

I think yes. In fact, I remember reading the proponents of the SSS 1School saying the vernacular schools should be merged, the government provides all the same funding and facilities as provided to national schools, run the same curriculum and syllabus as the national schools. It would not involve any changes to the physical set up of the vernacular schools, only the funding, facilities, etc. Even the teachers, clerical and other staff would be absorbed by the national teaching and clerical service.

No one would lose anything. Except the medium of instruction being in BM because it is the national language, the official language of the country. Mandarin and Tamil can be studied as elective subjects at the national schools. And the enrolment be more diverse so that the young in their formative years can mix and experience togetherness with members of the other communities. So that when they accidentally or by design meet one another after leaving school, they can, without any qualm, hesitation, or feeling of ackwardness, say, "apa khabar sekarang, buat apa sekarang". Such words, attitude and demeanour that would definitely foster goodwill, ease of relationship, naturalness of stimulus and reaction, making us better Malaysians, truly Malaysians, and all of us become Bangsa Malaysia, no longer identifying ourselves by our ethnic origin.

I'm sure these are the hopes and aspirations of most Malaysians, of concerned citizens like your writings have shown you to be, of rational minded people who are proud of our country and call this land our own. But there are a few who appear to run counter to these hopes and aspirations of ours. A few who I fear would poison the minds of our young against noble thoughts for our beloved country. Like Rwi Hau above.

Since the day I started reading his words in your blog, I have been concerned about this man. I didn't want to write at first out of respect for you, not wanting to set a different tone, as one is inclined to do reading what he writes. But he himself has begun to set a different tone, upped his ante. And I kept reading your words that you welcome comments. So, please allow me to start writing in a matter-of-fact and blunt manner, stern and stiff it may be, so that your readers can see the other side of the coin to what he has endlessly written. Let’s engage in a healthy, albeit tough debate, and hopefully more people would come to your blog, either just as readers or as commentators.

I hope you don't mind and allow me the space, and I'll start doing it by a subsequent comment. Thank you.

Dot.

Rwi Hau said...

@mr anonymous - u shud have kept urself away while u could. y do i see u here still? again, me the freakazoid here would like to reiterate that he's never liked nor apprecited the education he received at national school. in fact, i've studied the syllabus implemented at vernacular schools and i see no harm it will carry to the country. first hand or no first hand, SRJK(T) is different from SRJK(C). i believe u dun see the difference cuz u ain't got the balls to go see for urself or ur afraid of the truth. AGAIN, you haven't answered my questions mr. know it all.

this SSS is definitely not a mild campaign like u'd like to believe it is. read the petition and u'll know what i mean. i even featured it on one of my blog posts. i definitely see where ur going with that. if u SO want these schools to be shuttered, then i guess u shud be shouting for the closure of schools like SBP, MATRIKULASI, UiTM and Sekolah Agama(religious schools). there's no point in going with the so called 'MILD' SSS if you keep those schools opened while shutting down vernacular schools, mr righteous guy. U STILL HAVEN'T answered my question!!!

merging the schools? have we actually heard anything about a merger here except for the one like vision school? the content in the petition is like a piece of rag that's devouring my patience.

if i'm poisoning the minds of people like u, it only meas one thing. u aren't able to answer my questions still and i'm actually saying it right. i bet even rowanlim is saying that BM should be taught as an additional language. i take it that means it's not BM that she's pushing as the medium of instruction in schools. and ur saying BM should be the one. u see the prob here?

@rowan - again, u dun get what i'm trying to say here. i understand u've never been to a vernacular school before therefore u dun understand. but I HAVE. plz do tour these schools(SRJK(C) especially) for juz once. study their syllabus and see for urself why i changed my mind.

@auntie florence - u dun seem to get it do u? these other things are the things that are most crucial in countering the inequality. when JUSTICE is served, no one will feel their rights have been trampled over or feel left out. if u feel EQUALITY is sth that will be again partial to one race, i guess u need to go back and study what's the REAL MEANING OF EQUALITY.

no one's fighting for something that belongs to another country. is anyone here fighting for sth that belongs to another country? i juz dun see the case here. isn't using ENGLISH as the medium of instruction sth that belongs to another country but not ours? tell me what medium of instruction is to be used in this SSS? segregation has always been there auntie florence. UNITY doesn't begin with the so called SSS. UNITY begins when JUSTICE is served. sorry, i will never sign the petition. if u ain't got enuf people to support it, it means the majority of us dun like the idea. that is sad.

Anonymous said...

Rwi Hau,

I saw you riding very high here, appearing to give impressive arguments, comment after comment, only that those arguments are based on questionable premises, not taking into account the pertinent facts, and are not conducive to national unity, even destructive to the efforts of forging a united, strong and cohesive Bangsa Malaysia. If not rebutted, they may even be dangerous to young and innocent minds.

I will begin my rebuttal by taking you up on the subject of equality.

What equality are you talking about at this point and time? Why must you make it a condition for agreeing to support the 1School proposal for bringing about unity and a Bangsa Malaysia? Why aren’t you willing to become a Bangsa Malaysia so that in the process equality can fall into place?

Don’t you read the history of Malaya from its very beginning, or at least from the time the Secret Society Hai San Kapitan China of Larut and 44 of his gang members signing a Petition asking the British Resident in Penang to intervene and help regain their tin mines from the rival Secret Society gang the Ghee Hins? That which led to British Intervention and Colonialism in Malaya? And the British colonialists in the course of many, many years from 1874 to 1957 gave the Chinese mining land leases, lottery and gaming licenses and, later, licenses for rubber trading, etc? No help or encouragement for the Malays to do business. Built only a few schools in the kampongs where most Malays lived. And only primary schools at that. But built sufficient number of schools in the towns where most of the Chinese lived. And both primary and secondary schools in the towns. Don’t you know, or are you refusing to accept, that by Merdeka time, the Malays were far behind both economically and educationally? What equality are you talking about?

Dot.

TO BE CONTINUED IN PART2 (Blogger's lrngth limit)

Anonymous said...

PART 2

Rwi Hau,

Haven’t they told you, or are you again refusing to accept, the Social Contract? That the non-Malay leaders agreed at Merdeka time that the Malays be given Special Rights and, in consideration or in exchange for that, the Malay leaders agreed the non-Malays, who were not citizens, in fact stateless at that time, be given citizenship after Merdeka? That these were written in the Constitution? What equality are you talking about?

If by equality you mean no more Malay Special Rights, are you prepared to give up your citizenship right? Remember, the one was in exchange for the other.

Do you know that Tun Tan Siew Sin said in 1969 that the Malays were “generous enough” not only in agreeing to citizenship for the non-Malays but also relaxing the citizenship rules for the non-Malays to easily get their citizenship after Merdeka? Relaxing the language proficiency rule, for example? Or are you saying Tun Tan was not speaking for you or you don’t agree with what he said? Then if the Malays now say they also don’t agree to the giving of citizenship, where would that lead us to?

Don’t you realise that the Malays have been generous and given enough, yet gave some more by allowing 10% places at MARA in 2004? What are you giving in return? The proponents of the SSS say they are willing to forego being called Malays in this country, and be called Bangsa Malaysia, agree to the abolishment of all reference to race in identity cards and official documents. Are they not being generous again? And why can’t you?

And you want Malays to give up their right regarding MARA and all those promulgated under Article 153the Special Malay Rights of the Constitution so that there is what you call equality? Don’t you realize, or is it not convenient for you to say, that the Chinese are in control of the economy, that the Malays have only 18% corporate wealth, not counting other forms of wealth, in the country? What equality are you talking about?

Look at the big picture, man. Be broad-minded and not look at bits and pieces that may not even make a complete picture. Discrimination and corruption occur both in the public and the private sectors, those involved belong to all the communities and you can argue until Genting Highlands fall into the sea, you’ll not come to a consensus. But what happens in the meanwhile? Just leave things as they are? Won’t even support a 1School proposal aimed at bringing about unity? That’s not being responsible as citizens, is it?

I do want to engage you in a healthy debate, taking you on point by point, put a lot of questions to you, as you may put more questions in this blog. With the blog owner’s permission I hope, I’ll write in answering you comment after comment in due course.

Dot.

Rwi Hau said...

aren't we 'BANGSA MALAYSIA' ENUF? our hearts are channeled for the good of this country. and we still aren't bangsa malaysia enuf? we are actually held responsible for treason then aren't we for not being the BANGSA MALAYSIA mold u carved for us? clarify again what makes u think by forgoing our roots makes us BANGSA MALAYSIA?

i countered auntie florence with the word EQUALITY. what does equality mean? if we truly can't understand the word equality, i dun juz dun think we'll be able to talk here. fairness and equality and justice will serve as the basis for happiness and 'HEALTHY' competition. if you say the malays are left far behind, i wanna ask therefore. you think the chinese came here and got rich without effort? u think the chinese came here and fought for their education without effort? u think the chinece came here with all the wealth they could dig up from wherever they came from? u think lim goh tong built genting highlands in juz one day cuz the licence he received guaranteed that?

the hai sans, ghee hins are among the many of people who contributed to our nation building but never got enuf credits in our NATIONAL SCHOOL history books. dun even mention some of the indian nationalists who our children have never even heard of. there's even this short dialogue which to my utter dismay, shouldn't have been there at all. please read up NST. there's three articles altogether with the main theme 'WHOSE HISTORY IS OUR HISTORY'.

again, what kind of bangsa malaysia do u have in mind? let me tell u what i think u have in mind. speak in proper BM. go to national schools. dun even know their own roots(chinese and indians).

NJ said...

Salam Sejahtera Cik Rowan,

A question: wouldn't implementing a 1 school system force the government to be responsible for ALL the schools under its wing PLUS garner support from society for their development?

My take is that I agree with you.

The Government must be responsible for ALL schools under its wing because only the government have the 'might' to shoulder this responsibility. This 'might' in a way is reflected by tax-payers like us.

Of course, this 'might' is still lacking here and there (not 100%), which make it necessary for the government to garner further support from the society.

Imagine a society in a big sailing ship. If the ship is leaking somewhere, would a responsible part of society hastily jump-ship onto another? The loyalty toward the nation (ship) is rather quite questionable here. So if SKs have their "kelemahan", then we, as a responsible society should together adress these "kelemahan" rather than "unpatriotically" jump-ship onto SRJKs.

Eagle, I think, is very much of American pride. I think their national emblem or sort of "national identity" displays this Eagle Head. There stated also "In God we trust"

Ok now, let say I have had a bad experience with eagle. My beloved pet mouse was once swooped and eaten by an eagle. To add, I was also an "atheist", who do not believe in God whatsoever.

Equality on individual sense, would have given me ground to protest this so featured Eagle Head and the "In God we trust" moto.

But I will look at myself first, and ask who am I? where am I?

Am I a natural citizen of USA?

Am I a non-natural citizen of USA?

When I got offended by an Eagle Head, like someone got offended by a "Keris", and voice out my "rantings" without thinking, what do you think will happen?

If it were the old-aged laws, as a natural citizen of USA I would have be burnt alive by patriotic Americans the moment I smear the Eagle Head.

If I were the non-natural citizen, I would be been booted out of the country immediately with no chance of setting foot in American soil any longer.

Nowadays, patriotic government will give these "unloyal people" a show cause letter why they should not be stripped off citizenships. Some governments employ a softer approach by trying to win back the loyalty through BTN courses.

Thank you.

"SATU NEGARA, SATU BANGSA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

Rwi Hau said...

again, i wud say no one has answered my questions juz yet. either u have no valid answers to my questions or that i've hit the right chord. i dunno if one muz say the keris has no association with a specific race or not. but i do know the non-malays were heavily protesting against the wavy-dagger display by a high-ranking government official. if you take the case of the eagle, let me ask u another thing. does that eagle represent a certain race in the states? let me ask u again what comes to ur mind when a keris is brandished right in front of u? to say it's malaysian in its entirety is definitely. i dun share that culture of owning a keris. do u?

if u judge a person for being disloyal to the country cuz they go to vernacular schools, then what's the real meaning of being loyal to the country? by enrolling in a one school system and be fed with whatever this school is feeding us? or maybe by changing ur name to suit the bangsa malaysia u guyz are talking about. maybe let the government decide for u on what terms u shud be on. i went to national schools. in our history book, how many times have the names of those involved in our nation-building(esopecially non-malays) been touched? the current history book(form 3) is even worse. refer to NST's whose history is our history. dun tell me we dun know not an ounce about contributions by the non-malays to our own country?

since u mentioned the united states of america into the picture here. i guess we shud be talking bout the states then. in the states, all people are equal under the country's constitution. no one is above the law. your rights are definitely guaranteed. i bet u've never watched whoopi goldberg's movie on racism. if u bring any unlawful acts to the courts in the US, if ur on the right side, u'll definitely win. that's how the african-americans challenged the white supremacists in the first place starting from ROSA PARKS. every individual soul in the states is guaranteed of their rights to a good set of education, meaning scholarships are awarded not based on color, but their excellent results. do we see any discrimination in education in the states? i see alot in malaysia.

the one school system will not only make the chinese relinquish their language, it will relinquish a more than a 4 decades of tradition that they have been practising. if u think u can stop those in favor of vernacular schools from going to vernacular schools, i guess u r not practising what you guyz have been bz promoting in the one school system, equality.

Anonymous said...

Mr Rwi Hau

I don't understand "aren't we 'BANGSA MALAYSIA' ENUF? our hearts are channeled for the good of this country." How to know that?

About "no one has answered my questions juz yet." One person there talk about equality. You ask about that before.

Now you talk about justice. Mebe he will talk this next time. I hope. I also want to know.

Anonymous said...

Rwi

You said "the hai sans, ghee hins are among the many of people who contributed to our nation building but never got enuf credits in our NATIONAL SCHOOL history books".

How can? The Hai Sans and Ghee Hins were secret societies, thugs and gangsters. How can you want school children to admire what you call "contributions". What values are you going by, appreciating the "contributions" of thugs and gangsters.

More importantly, their Petition to the British in Penang led to the British intervening in Perak and bloody British Colonialism in the country. How can you glorify them?

What are you? You belong to the group that wants Chin Peng and MCP to come back? You must be the subversive kind.

DeejayDude said...

Aloo you chinese rui hau macha!

Very china la you macha! Dude, are you prepared to give up your chinese-tounge since you talked about equality?

Dont be like that la macha! all take, take, take nothing to give ka macha?!

I agree with you when you said USA is more equal than us here. They take hundreds of years to reach that la!. Their president dont insist speaking in african-tounge, that's why red indians & white americans voted for him. china macha like you kinda slow things down la here macha! You dont seem wanting to be equal la macha! so hipocrit la you!

You are paranoid with keris ka macha? When I looked at the jata/emblem, that is Malaysian emblem la, not melayu emblem. Itu keris bukan melayu saja punya la dey!

You know why itu melayu hishamudin show show the keris ha? Because hard core china like you la macha! Itu melayu sudah mengamok! Very difficult for a malay to mengamuk macha! dont la, I also want to live in peace as Malaysians.. like itu Amoi Rowan (sorry he..he..) said la, "now the next step is to be Malaysian".

You first step sudah failed la macha!

Ayo! yo! ini china rui hau banyak china la dey!

Deejay Dude

Rowan said...

Maybe I should add something here; my vision of what the ideal national school would have:
1. English as the medium of instruction.
2. Bahasa Malaysia taught as the national language.
3. Tamil & Mandarin provided as elective subjects.
4. Standardized education system

What I hope this system will achieve:
1. The youth will see each other as Malaysians.
2. The youth will see a need to change the status quo to promote EQUALITY IN EVERY AREA & ELIMINATE DISCRIMINATION.
3. A better more unified Malaysia.

Now the majority of young Malays don't see the need to give up their privileges. Neither do Chinese or Indian youths see the importance of national unity. This kind of mindset has to start from young & the school is the best age to begin.

Anonymous said...

Rwi Hau said, “@mr anonymous - u shud have kept urself away while u could”.

See, the kind of thinking this fellow has? Instead of engaging in a healthy debate, he wants people to shut up. Yet he cries about what he calls equality.

Now he says people don’t answer him. Didn’t he read the comment about equality that he wanted answers on before? Or he’s just being difficult? Or simply utters whatever comes thru his nose? A loose gun, maybe.

He must have a terrible chip on his shoulder, finding everything wrong everywhere and unable to see the horizon. He must be made to see reason, rationality and reasonableness. I will continue below my comments, tackling one subject that he raises after another, hoping to get him in that direction. With that kind of mindset, he would always twist and turn, but at least readers can see the alternative views:

Rwi Hau,

Your arguments cannot be right or rational if your premise is wrong or not wholly factual, but half truths or mere perceptions. For example, it has become an established fact for scores of years now, and internationally, that Chin Peng and the Malayan Communist Party were terrorists. You would be wrong if you argue that they were nationalists.

The half-truth (or even less than half) was that the Malayan People’s Anti-Japanese Army rose against the Japanese and may be seen as nationalists, but Chin Peng who was China-inclined, who went to China and took instructions, and the MCP which fought the democratically elected government after Merdeka and a constitution based on the principles of parliamentary democracy, of rule by the majority, of law and order, they were certainly not nationalists. They were, in fact, anti-nationalists, wanting to establish a China-leaning communist government in this country. Imagine what would have happened to us if they succeeded; we would probably be following orders from the People’s Republic of China now. Is that what you want?

Dot.
TO BE CONTINUED IN PART 2 (Blogger length limit)

Anonymous said...

PART 2

Rwi Hua,

Now, to deal with your favourite question:

“what kind of an identity do we need to lump all of these races into? malay? chinese? or indian? or maybe orang asli? it's a compelete lie again if you think ur gonna tell other people that ur a proud bangsa malaysia without mentioning ur ethnic background. please, i'm a realistic person.”

And you said again, “what kind of identity shud u lump all of these races into? if u say as malaysian in a whole, i bet u still aren't matured enuf. singapore is the best example to that. and tell me what kind of identity/ culture/ religion/ language does a malaysian possess? does a malaysian speak in BM? or does a malaysian speak in mandarin? or maybe tamil as we speak? it juz doesn't make sense at all.”

Either you are not able, or refuse, to think what a Malaysian identity would be. These people have been talking about not identifying themselves as Malays, Chinese, Indians, etc but as Bangsa Malaysia, and are willing to try that, yet you talk about “complete lie”, “not matured”, etc. Can’t you imagine it, man? No more words such sa “Race” in application forms, in i/cs, in official documents, and when asked, especially overseas, we proudly saying we are Malaysians? Of course, in Malaysia when necessary, we would go into the detail e.g state our ethnic origin – but only when necessary, not as a matter of course.

And why are you quoting Singapore? Has anybody ever said that the Bangsa Malaysia can come about in a flicker of the eye, in a year, 5 years or even 10 years? This Bangsa Malaysia is for our children, grandchildren and those after them, man. We must start creating it now and, if we are lucky, may be able to experience and feel it before we leave this world ourselves. Don’t you want to leave this world knowing that our loved ones are or would be living in an atmosphere of harmony, peace and prosperity? If you do, let’s start doing something positive about it.

Rowan here has done something positive in her blog. I have not gone to your blog and I shudder at the thought of going there after seeing what you write in here - even in another person’s blog. See, what you make people do – I’ve tended to segregate myself from you because your non-constructive views even expressed here appear to be detrimental to efforts of bringing about national unity. Nevertheless, I’m prepared to engage you here and I know you enough from your writings here.

Dot.

TO BE CONTINUED IN PART 3

Anonymous said...

PART 3

Rwi Hau,

By saying, “tell me what kind of identity/culture/religion/ language does a malaysian possess? does a malaysian speak in BM? or does a malaysian speak in mandarin? or maybe tamil as we speak?”, you don’t appear to even acknowledge Bahasa Malaysia.

I’ll save until a later time the historical facts about Malay being the lingua franca of this entire region since even before the Srivijaya Kingdom in the 7th Century. For now, I just want to ask you:

Do you not know that

- when the Portuguese, the Dutch and the British came to these shores, they found the people speaking Malay; that they didn’t know the language but got people to interpret for them

- When they ruled this country as Colonizers, they learnt Bahasa Melayu, some of them to a high level of proficiency; people like R.O Winstedt and R.J Wilkinson even prepared a dictionary of the Malay language

- That the British Colonial Government trained their expatriate Officers in the Malay language, and the British front-line Officers, like District and Land Officers, communicated with the locals in Bahasa Melayu

Do you realize that

- Bahasa Melayu is written in the Constitution of the country and that the Constitution is the highest set of laws of the country and must be respected?

- That in the discussions among the leaders of the major communities before Merdeka, the non-Malay leaders agreed that Bahasa Melayu be the Official Language and is written as Article 152 of the Constitution?

- That Bahasa Melayu is the official language and the national language of the country?

If you do, why are you not respecting it? Why are you asking those questions? You want Malaysians to speak in the official language of PRC or Tamil Nadu, India, ha? Yet you say you are a “realistic” person. What kind of realism do you live by? A realism of your own, ha? Your own world, your own choices, never mind the choices of others, even of your forefathers at Merdeka, don’t bother about the facts of history, the sanctity of the Constitution, ha? Cannot like this, la, man. Try to be a conciliatory, give-and-take, reasonable Malaysian, la. Let’s think of the future generations.

The Constitution talks about “the legitimate interest of the others.” Those legitimate interests have been protected, respected and taken care of. Nobody says cannot learn or teach Mandarin or Tamil. Nobody said the others cannot speak mother-tongue languages. Mandarin is not even the mother-tongue of the Chinese in this country. Yet the Malays have been and will continue to be accomodating. These subjects can be taught and studied as elective subjects under the SSS 1School proposal. But they cannot be the medium of instruction for reasons I and others have explained lengthily above and elsewhere.

Dot

TO BE CONTINUED IN PART 4 (Length limit by Blog Control)

Anonymous said...

PART 4 (addressed to Rwi Hau)

Indeed, English is important and Malaysians must also be fluent in it. Especially for advancement in science and technology. Most Malays, including the promoters of SSS, speak for the teaching of Mathematics and Science in English. Sure there will be problems; Malays even complain the rural children face big handicaps. But we should and must find ways to solve those problems, like specialist teacher training, find dedicated ones, give incentives for those willing to teach in rural areas and in towns where such problems are encountered. But we must not go into nitty gritties, finding faults with teachers, etc. We must not miss the bush for the trees.

National unity and the future of all Malaysians are at stake. Yet you are even gleeful of “not enuf people sign it” and sarcastically said “feel sad”. Getting demeaning or demented, aren’t you? The promoters are now calling for a referendum, again asking things be done in a peaceful and democratic manner. The majority will decide. But for now, don’t gamble on the future of Malaysians, man. Don’t say you don’t want to support the proposal because you don’t know what Bangsa Malaysia would be like at the end of it. Your stand is not logical, not rational at all. The chicken or the egg first? The cart before the horse? You wouldn’t know what it would be like until you try, would you?

Dot.

Anonymous said...

rWI hAU,

WAT IS YOUR QUESTION LAH???

Rwi Hau said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Rwi Hau said...

@deejaydude - dey pandi. equality is never about giving up ur mother tongue. u still dun understand what's equality. equality means everyone possesses the most fundamental human rights. everyone is equal under the constitution. that keris brandishing is definitely not because he went amok or sth. it's a show of supremacy and to tell the non-malays here who's their TUAN. and equality is never about giving up ur own race. if u feel so, juz give up ur indian accent or facial features then. let's see if you could do juz that. and drop that macha word. i juz dun think ur an indian.

@anonymous - read what i've posted if u wanna know what my questions are. if u dunno means u never read. and heck we certainly dunno if our hearts are directed toward the country. but like u can guarantee those who go to national schools are patriotic enuf? dun they do bribes? let alone be ready to fight for the country? and u certainly cannot guarantee those who go to vernacular schools aren't patriotic or jingoistic. the level of absurdity is too much too take.

the hai sans and ghee hins were secret triads. yes, but i bet the national school history books never told u what's beyond than that. that's how i went thru without ever knowing a single thing about these two groups until that article 'whose history is our history' came out and cleared the haze. u dunno? unsurprising cuz we went to national schools. alot have been left out and alot more that we dun know still. no point in getting there.

plus, rowan wrote 'Maybe I should add something here; my vision of what the ideal national school would have:
1. English as the medium of instruction.
2. Bahasa Malaysia taught as the national language.
3. Tamil & Mandarin provided as elective subjects.
4. Standardized education system'
and mr anonymous, do u see what's being brought forth here? ENGLISH AS THE MEDIUM OF INSTRUCTION. which means u guyz who are supposedly on the same bandwagon can't agree on the medium of instruction juz yet. yet u wanna keep saying unity can spring up from the one school system? already there are different factions among u guyz. amusing enuf.

my bangsa malaysia has never been about those u described. because all i know is bangsa malaysia is the most unique in the world. they live multiracially and multireligiously. and they speak in three languages, with BM as the national language. of course that'd mean the non-malays are bi or trilingual. they go to different schools but their hearts are for the country. they can practise their religions freely.

most of the chinese are against the one school for all proposal. which is why the DPM had to reject the petition in the first place. everything is politics. that's the living proof of it.

and i bet u still dun get it do u? i've said for many many times. u went to national schools. u dun understand anything about vernacular schools. i certainly dun wanna talk about the social contract. and i never knew if the states ever needed one. keeping this up has no meaning at all. keep on promoting ur one school for all. cuz i really am hoping for sth miraculous that'd win me over to ur side. i was really really for one school for all once. i was really hopeful of that goal. i was so proud that i could only take BM as the medium of instruction in schools cuz that'd be the only way to unify us. however, i was dang wrong. being stabbed once is enuf to make ur heart bleed incessantly. but three times? u muz be kidding me. and i muz say first cut is definitely the deepest. enjoy ur day.

Rwi Hau said...

owh and u wrote this, very obvious isn't it----> 'very disappointing... keeping away from freakazoids like you i must do'.

i dun think i have the thinking like u do. u said u wanted to keep away from freakozoids like me. so what kind of mentality are u displaying here? i was only patronizing u instead cuz u started it.

again i quote what u wrote--->'all this rambling about national identity is superfluous. i think people should be free to practise watever culture they want'.

this is exactly why vernacular schools must stay on with modifications. your word on freedom to practise their culture is a testament to that.

Anonymous said...

Why you say "if u dunno means u never read"? I read. But you say not clear.

And I don't understand you say "we certainly dunno if our hearts whether are directed toward the country." Why you not explain like that man.

Also why you want "guarantee those who go to national schools are patriotic enuf".

And can you explain "dun they do bribes? let alone be ready to fight for the country?" I not heard and dont understand.

Anonymous said...

Hau

"you think the chinese came here and got rich without effort? u think the chinese came here and fought for their education without effort? u think the chinece came here with all the wealth they could dig up from wherever they came from?"

Hey dude, those people were saying they were left behind because the British helped the Chinese a lot and did not help them much during British rule la. Why are you talking about the Chinese working hard?

Answer them la. They explained and asked you so many questions. You answer them la.

You have not said one word about importance of BM, respect for the Constitution and so on. I want to know whether you respect the Constitution of Malaysia and the role of BM.

I don’t see you explain much but complain a lot. Explain la.

I am also interested in this discussion. I still struggle with my BM but I see a lot in what they say. I want peace and harmony for my small children in the future.

Devan

Radin87 said...

From my point of view..
As I'm also once studying in chinese school before enrolled in Sekolah Kebangsaan. Both of the school education systems are almost the same. The only differs is the language that being used.

I'm appreciate the idea of 1school systems which means uniting all this school into 1 school system. So, all schools are treated fair and square. I think thats the main point here.

The idea of of vernacular school is because of our nature to respect our traditions, and this students can actually learn in their own mother's tongue.

Each of them has its own advantages.

Anonymous said...

Wooooaaaa!!! so much discussion since I first came here! Took me quite a bit of time to read through the comments!

Hey people, I believe the subject here is one school system? How come I saw much of it is politic?

Rwi Hau,

You said you are a staunch supporter of one school, especially vision school (your first post). Good man!

But how come your lengthy ramblings, mostly politic I see, end up you being anti everything?

You began with equality and you move on to despise keris, national emblem, on and on until you look like you are against one school. One big roundabout, man! what are you trying to say?!

come on lah! keris is the symbol of this nation. Please respect it! They just dont merrily pick up keris to be part of national emblem. There must be a lot of history behind it.

Why dont you rally the people to ask the Agong to change the keris and perhaps the tigers too in the national emblem? Put dragons and bamboo sticks instead?!

Aiyah! I too have become a politician. Talk! Talk! Talk! nothing gets done while our education still rottens!

Give it up man! You dont like it, just go away. You are not the flock of birds of same feathers as San Peng put it.

You do annoy me. Sorry!

Kn.L

Rwi Hau said...

@anonymous - what i meant was if your hearts are channeled toward the country, it means U ARE CONTRIBUTING. to say we aren't contributing is unacceptable. u dun understand because u dun read!!

by mentioning singapore would give u a clearer picture as to what identity they are packing as a sovereign nation. the failure to draw such an example is a failure on ur own part becuz u dun seem to understand. singapore is the best example becuz it went the direction you guyz are fighting for.

again, rowan mentioned english should be the medium of instruction in the one school system. well, u said it should be BM. BM would never work in bringing our people together since it's highly associated with juz one race. i believe english has the power to unify us. if u can agree on english being the medium of instruction, i'll back u up. but now, the only one who's seeing this with me is only rowan.

people are different. diversity is everywhere. u can't deny it. one school for all is gonna do what? kinda mixes us all up together so that we dunno our racial roots anymore? what makes us unique in the first place? we are malays, chinese and indians. we have different types of schools becuz this is a free country, everyone is free to practise what they prefer to. if somehow u mix this all up together, what or whom will we be? another new nation? religion is already causing such chaos. as radin87 pointed out, he's been to chinese vernacular schools. what he said is a testament to what i said in the first place. again, u people can't seem to be able to accept the truth!!

i'm not saying malaysians should be speaking in mandarin, or tamil. i'm juz saying what kind of identity should a true malaysian be packing? when u took it the wrong way only it felt disrespectful. u can't even give me a proper identity for bangsa malaysia. yet, ur telling me to shut it? and ur complaining im being disrespectful toward our country? yeah rite!! can't i juz be a normal average chinese malaysian who speaks in english, bm and mandarin? and if go to chinese vernacular schools, what is wrong with that? again radin87 had already given the real picture of vernacular schools here. i believe only those who truly understand what's being taught in vernacular schools will be able to comprehend.

and i dun think i've been making rude comments here. well, maybe it's something u can't accept, maybe the truth is too hard to handle. if u say i couldnt accept what u said, at least i countered u by covering some grounds here. i never used derogatory names unless someone really pushed it too far. i dun think i started it even if i did use some. who's being disrespectful here?

do u think those who go to national schools are completely or 100% patriotic? u clearly indicated that those who go to vernacular schools aren't patriotic.

u mentioned this---> "with that regard, SSS is silent on the national identity @ culture. It is more moderate than the thailand of philiphine policy. Good lah in that case. If people are also opposing this mild SSS campaign, then I do not know what else to say...if people who oppose this also do not have the solution as to what the national identity should be, then they should just keep their peace rather than incite hatred and writing rude comment smack of arrogance".
well, i dunno if you've read the content of the petition. if u say this SSS stuff is more moderately positioned compared to those in thailand and the phillipines, maybe u should do some homework before taking this out here?

nationalists or no nationalists, i would love it if you could dig up the articles on NST with the headline 'whose history is our history' and read about'em. you'll find'em insightful.

Rwi Hau said...

@Kn.L - "You began with equality and you move on to despise keris, national emblem, on and on until you look like you are against one school. One big roundabout, man! what are you trying to say?!"
that's becuz u didn't read. despising the keris is what u said, and wasn't my message at all. i was only affirming my position where i thought about the wavy-dagger(keris) waving being disrespectful to the non-malays and yet it appears on a blog promoting the one school for all petition. can't it be something else? something that will be less sensitive to all?

this is purely politics. the rejection of the petition is the living proof of it. because the government doesn't want to lose the non-malays votes that had shifted to the opposition.

@devan - owh, the british helped the chinese alot? let's see this from a different angle. juz take a look at who's being helped a lot now? and have these people who're being fed succeeded and ready to make concessions? how many years did it take the chinese to succeed? did it not need hard work? if u think by being given the upper hand and not working hard will guarantee success, then i muz say ur so out of touch. look at malaysia.

i dun think i should anyways touch about BM. rowan pointed out english should be the medium of instruction. while most of u are for BM. i guess there muz be some misunderstanding here about the one school for all? even this you guyz can't agree on. let alone three major races in one school demanding their rights to be upheld. that'd be like impossible.

the minute before, someone wanted a healthy debate. the minute after, someone asked me to beat it. awrite. healthy debate no more. thanx for patronizing me.

Rowan said...

Rwi Hau got it right; I don't want BM to be the medium of instruction. Let it be a subject of the national language, not the medium for any subject.

Guys, don't bicker please. Just post your opinion & let it play out :)

Anonymous said...

Why you say many time "u dun understand because u dun read!"?

Again you only say "what i meant was if your hearts are channeled toward the country, it means U ARE CONTRIBUTING. to say we aren't contributing is unacceptable." What you mean? Please tell more.

How I contribute by my heart channeled to the country?

Anonymous said...

Hau

There you go again.

You keep on talking the Chinese work very hard. Everybody knows that. Why keep on saying it? And don't even acknowledge the fact that the British didn't help the others much but helped you all a lot?

Please respond directly to the questions asked. Then we have a proper discussion and I also get to know more.

I read somewhere the British called the Malays lazy and the Indian railway workers used to chew betel nut all the time (sorry people, just to make a point). But no need to talk about these if that's what you are hinting.

The Indians don't get special privileges but we get citizenship. The Indians are are the majority in Fiji but don't get special rights because they came to the island later. Could run the country after elections but the military took power. I read in Demi Negara and agree with the Indian leader long time ago saying in Burma and other countries they don't treat us well. They even nationalised foreigners' properties.

Then you say "if u think by being given the upper hand and not working hard will guarantee success, then i muz say ur so out of touch." There you go again. You are saying Chinese work hard, implying others don't. Say people don't read, out of touch. Apa ini?

Then you say "even this you guyz can't agree on. let alone three major races in one school demanding their rights to be upheld. that'd be like impossible." What kind of argument is this? I thought you went to University.

People already disagreeing and you want to compartmentalise them instead of bringing them together and hope some agreement comes later.

I am beginning to worry about you and your thinking. My children's future is at stake. This is my country and I don't want to go any where else.

Devan

faiz_0586 said...

hiya guyz. my best bet here is that mr. anonymous here does not understand english at all and therefore keep on repeating the same thing over and over again asking people why this and why that and what do u mean?.

you seem to be suggesting that rwi hau keeps on implying the chinese are hardworking. i think u dun understand what message he's trying to bring by depicting that. and the real reason why he's implying that is because u keep on repeating the same thing. dun u get it? what's an upper hand? u dun get it. what's hard work? u dun get it. who's being given the upper hand now and why haven't those given the upper hand succeeded, devan(u sound not like an indian to me)? it all falls on hard work yet u keep repeating the same thing. u admitted to it only NOW!!!

it's so naive of you to think that someone here is trying to marginalize themselves or trying to push a wedge among those in support of SSS. it's funny. i guess this guy here is giving u a clear wake up call that those in support of SSS can't seem to agree on the medium of instruction. factor in another three races. i dun believe the non-malays would want BM as the medium of instruction. only the malays would push for such to take place. hence, ur either a malay like me or a very very idealistic person which for your information, won't last long in this world.

i read NST's whose history is our history. yes those two groups haven't had the credits they were supposed to get a long time ago.

NJ said...

Dear Rowan,

Bahasa Kebangsaan (BM) has its place in the Perlembagaan Persekutuan, which is regarded as the highest set of law in this country.

Having said that, Malaysians shall continue to debate on this language 'issue', until we reach a point where we Malaysians can form a clear majority stance.

While debating, being a good citizen, we should observe and respect the existing laws. Observing & respecting the law does not mean that we cannot discuss on the law itself. Have a healthy discussion, amalkan Kesopanan & Kesusilaan (Rukun Negara). Discussion does not warrant the existing law be broken at liberty. That is illegitimate and can be subjected to law and order. Also rehearse this proverb dearly, understand it inside-out, "Di mana bumi dipijak, di situ langit dijunjung". This is applicable anywhere, anytime in this world.

A soccer game cannot be played when the rules changes all the times. It is also not a game, if the referee allows the rules to be broken. Set the rules, then play. Improve the rules, and then play again.

Salam.

"SATU BANGSA, SATU NEGARA, SATU BAHASA"

NJ

P/s: Dear Rowie, thank you for your warm welcome. You are such a good host to me. Please do excuse me.

To all who may have given clarifications on my behalf, I thank you for taking the trouble. It save my breath. Thanks.

To those who are interested in this "ONE SCHOOL", pros and cons, please contribute your ideas at the original initiator of the campaign at deminegara.blogspot.com.

Thank you all.

Salam Sejahtera

Deejay Dude said...

Rui Hau,

You dont think I am Indian? Right! Right! I am Malaysian! But asked me to drop my 'macha' accent, OK! I am dropping it.

You are chinese! The type who give nothing but demand anything on earth! Why?

Because you had problem with hishamudin. You dont settle you problem with him, but you blamed it on keris! what and who else on your blame list? the malays, the schools, the emblem, this country, the list goes on and on for you but all these just because you had problem with hishamudin. You are so weird! yeah! I forgot, you are the kind who has nothing to give but everything to gobble up!

My advice to you since you get offended on the innocent keris. That thing is a major part of the symbol of this country. You will see it almost everywhere. So, why dont you go to shang dung, kwang tung or wherever, where there is no keris at all?

You are one weird guy, always want everything in your way. Look hard in the mirror lah!

Deejay Dude

SZahari said...

the 'dude' word always refers to someone who's lazy, someone who slouches. your comment isn't something that's called healthy. rather it is full of hatred and nothing constructive. being lazy that is.

as i was reading the comments, i thought it's funny when someone was told to drop the 'macha' word. let me address the guy who's told to drop the word 'macha' as D. D mentioned he wanted to be a true malaysian when he was still busy engaging in his antics. odd isn't it when he still uses dey, macha, etc. aren't all these something that are associated with indians? weird. indians don't normally do this. they don't normally put all these tamil words when they are writing something. so, my guess here is the same as rwi hau's. D is not an indian cause he was bad at pretending to be one.

no one is busy asking for something and not thinking about what they can give back. this is basically a mentality associated with supremacists who'd keep asking what the non-malays can give back to the country. typical. bumped into them all the time. let me tell you why this isn't valid. i have a chinese friend. we've been friends since high school. and do you know what was his ambition during high school before everything went down the drain because of the social contract i don't know who mentioned it somewhere this comment column. he wanted to contribute to the country by becoming a surgeon at a government hospital. he was smart, really smart. his results could have guaranteed him a full scholarship from the government. notice the term 'could have'. instead, the privileges went to those who weren't supposed to be on the list. so, you know where he ended up in? the UK under singapore's government scholarships. funny thing is, the malaysian government is exactly like D here asking him what he can give back to the country and that he's supposed to come back to malaysia. so, he's not supposed to feel grateful to singapore for the scholarship but he has to feel grateful to the very government who turned him away since he was granted citizenship by the bumiputras? there's nothing top contend here. by being granted the citizenship, the non-bumiputras have to feel grateful. alright. by being the bumiputrasm who are automatically the citizens of malaysia don't need them to feel grateful. that's funny. what's wrong with the head of these people? does not make sense at all. ok, what's funnier is those(bumiputras) under malaysian government scholarships never tried to give back to the country. where's the validity of your asking that the non-malays should be giving back to the country when most of them were turned away by the government? the supremacists!!!

L.H. Liang said...

to mr. deejaydude,

ask not what others can give to you. but what you can give to others. i guess this part of rwi hau's comments below would be able to counter what you're questioning.

"you mentioned 'bout what i can contribute to the country. haven't i sacrificed enuf of what i have for the country when i had to give up my rights for someone else's happiness? is that called FAIR and EQUAL? i went thru a lot and trust me i've been thru it. you might not understand the real situation out there but you DEFINITELY WILL when that unfairness falls upon you".

Saleh M.S. Omar said...

i as a malay myself do have a problem with the keris waving at UMNO's general assembly. being insensitive toward other races is unacceptable. if you feel that has nothing to do with SUPREMACISM, let's ask what our national school's form three history book says about the ketuanan melayu term.

Luca Tosches said...

i'm a friend currently studying in the states. i wish to point out here on what deejaydude has been questioning.

if rwi is the type of chinese who don't give back to the country, i muz ask then what have you given back to your own country deejaydude? if by studying hard and feeling grateful for being guaranteed the rights to education and channeling your life to contribute to the country means giving nothing back to the country, i take it that means by jaywalking throughout your high school and college years without an apparent ambition is the answer. it's illogical. if you think you're contributing to your country, tell me what are your contributions!!!

if you think by pushing for the 'One School For All' campaign means your patriotic, i just don't think you understand the real meaning of freedom and justice.

i believe i read about rwi's comments on malaysia's religious schools, UiTM, Matriculasi and boarding schools that they segregate according to races and religions too. and i so far have not seen anyone here talking about'em. whether rwi was righfully correct about'em or those attacking him were completely in disarray for not being able to counter the fact.

in the states, all of us go to either public or private schools with only english as the medium of instruction, yet we differ racially, religiously and culturally. are we united or do we think the same? no. we are totally different. your facial features will not lie to you. people can trace your line of descent by looking at you. in the states, all of us speak american english, yet we are still divided politically. we are still labeled according to our races, whether we are white, black, hispanic or others. this is the truth. cause you are who you are. by doing away your racial background won't do you any good. like i mentioned, your facial features don't lie. live with the fact!! if you say a single language can unite all of malaysians, that'd be a complete lie. in the states, people are heavily divided on issues like abortion and gay rights. you see, there'll still be divisions and factions. the most important of all is how you're gonna handle it. and yeah, look hard into the mirror deejaydude. look hard!! you will find out exactly who you are!!

Anonymous said...

Wooo!! Hooo!! Hooooo!!!

All these malay names zahari, saleh and the other two liang, luca are spelt:-

'Rui Hau'!!!!!

Pretending to be malay haaa? Well you still sound the same! Why bother?

Still the Dee Jay! yeahh!!

Deejay Dude

S.Zahari said...

oh please deejaydude. ignorant much? i don't know about the others, but i'm definitely not rwi hau. i am saddiq zahari, check me out on facebook.

L.H. Liang said...

just shut it. i'm loke hai liang. not two liang, you son of a bitch. i too am on facebook. add me. can't wait to see your ugly face too. or your scared? did the big bad wolf scare you that you are afraid to tell us your real name?

Rowan said...

Guys don't fight please. I wrote this topic to express how I feel about the matter.

I appreciate the input from everyone but seriously, if you're gonna keep attacking each other, I'll have to close this topic down.

PS. Rwi Hau is himself. He never posted as anyone else.

Rwi Hau said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Rwi Hau said...

err, sorry. i thot this could be a healthy debate. really sorry rowan. my bad.

Anonymous said...

Sorry Rowan

I just wanted to know. But that person says I dun read, I cannot understand.

But he dont answer people. I dont like him. I also want to close.

Mahallah Nahman said...

i do not necessarily agree with this one school for all thingy. firstly, however brilliant this idea is feasibility will be a huge matter as far as this country is concerned. here are a few issues:

i) new blocks/schools will be needed (i hope i dun need 2 explain tat)

ii)given the m'sian/malay govt's mentality chinese and indian languages will 'disappear'

iii) once the full control of education system is with the govt they'll start promoting '1 m'sia' which basically says indians n chinese r slaves of the malay master.

iv) regardless of the same schools malays will still get into matriculation and graduate 1 year earlier in better courses. chinese n indian people will b pissed anyway...so wers the unity in tat?

v) after 50years the malay govt cant decide on the language to use... u think they can come up with proper syllabus...the already incompetent m'sia will become worse


vi) comparitive advantage - we know chinese schools n indian schools maintain higher standards than malays/public schools...given the status-quo tats the oni advantage we have over the malays...now the govt seeks to destroy tat n make us just as dumb..



so with all tis n more(malas wanna write redy) wat shall thou say Miss Rowie Bowie Jowie Ann

Rwi Hau said...

dun further complicate matters here anonymous. i dun like u too. we're definitely not the two sides of the same coin. i doubt if all "malaysians" agree with what you said. i'll forever counter ur idealistic principle which promotes ethnic cleansing. u definitely don;t read. plus, u dun answer the most critical issue of all. i just dun see what's ur stand on MATRIKULASI, UiTM, SBP(MCKK, etc) and Sekolah Agama? u keep on saying vernacular schools segregate malaysians. i've answered u. on malaysian identity. u still can't give me a clear picture of it. cuz u think a malaysian should be speaking in malay, go to national schools and changing their names like those chinese in thailand, indonesian and the phillipines. if you think the malays are willing to give up their own race, THAT'S GOOD. REALLY GOOD. where's that stated anywhere in the petition huh?

Rwi Hau said...

the petition doesn't say anything about sbp(mckk, etc), matrikulasi, UiTM and sekolah agama. u think we are that dumb to think the bumiputras are that generous for alloting 10% of their supposedly rightful places in matriculation colleges? again, it was all politics. think again how dr. m won so many non-malays votes in 1999. people trusted him? yeah. what a coincidence heh that he alloted the 10% just before the election in 1999. it's told over and over again. whatever learned in vernacular schools is the same in national schools. i told u to dig up the articles on the new straits times on 'whose history is our history'. i dun think u have. either ur too bz engaging in ur malay sentiments or too bz promoting to us that vernacular schools segregate malaysian without a word on malay boarding schools, UiTM, matriculation colleges and religious schools. where's the validity of that? u think by going to one school for all, our rights are upheld once and for all? hahahaahahaha. very funny. u want me to beliebve it. i can. just scrap those other schools i mention then i'll believe u are fighting for unity among us. but i bet that won't happen rite? cuz those schools are like ur tradition. same thing here. vernacular schools are our tradition!!! please respect what's written in the constitution. if u say we are questioning article 153 or wtv in the constitution, aren't u questioning it too cuz vernacular schools are definitely given the greenlight and their existence is guaranteed under the constitution. amusing enuf huh? talk to our DPM if u dun believe me. listen to what he'll as to why he rejected ur so SACRED PETITION.

Anonymous said...

Rowan,

I was away for nearly a week and now find you have moved on with new postings.

I also find that Rwi Hau kept putting out views, including repeating what he said earlier.

I have while away without internet access, prepared more explanations on subjects he had raised earlier. Please allow me space for these "other side of the coin", at least for the record. Thank you.

Given below is the first one, followed after that as additional comments.

Rwi Hau,

As stated earlier, I will take you up on the points you put out one by one. This time it is on the Malay boarding schools.

Malay boarding schools are in two categories. One is Malay College Kuala Kangsar (MCKK) which was set up by the British well before World War II. It was the result of discussions between the British Resident and the Sultan of Perak on the deed to train Malays to participate in the administration of the country, even before independence. That in itself was testament to the recognition by the British of the hegemony of the Malays in this country and their importance in the affairs of running the country.

Indeed, many Malays who have studied in that school were recruited into the Malay Administrative and the expatriate dominated Malayan Civil Service, including the 2nd Prime Minister, Tun Abdul Razak. This is a special institution with its own history for the Malays and is certainly part of the Special Malay Rights spelled out in Article 153 of the Constitution.

The other category is the MARA schools called the Maktab Rendah Sains MARA (MRSM). Again, MARA was set up under the Special Malay Rights Article of the Constitution. The MRSMs were a response to the dearth of Malays qualified in the various sciences, a problem created by the lack of attention and help during the scores of years of British colonial rule. The British built only a few schools in the kampongs where most Malays lived; such schools were only at primary level. Whereas in the towns where most Chinese lived, they built a sufficient number of schools, both at primary and secondary levels. Malay boarding schools were designed to assist the Malays, who were left far behind economically and educationally, to catch up with the others in the field of education.

Raising the matter of the Malay boarding schools might attract Malays to raise the matter of citizenship of the non-Malays because the Malay Special Rights were in exchange for the citizenship right of the non-Malays. As these are sensitive matters and come under the purview of the Sedition Act, everybody is well advised not to harp on them.

The Special Malay Rights are not issues but are well established and historically recorded facts - agreed among leaders of the major communities - and must not be discussed. They cannot be issues because they are written in the Constitution, the highest set of laws in the country. Every loyal Malaysian citizen must respect the Constitution. Talking about changes in the Constitution on sensitive matters is dangerous and can lead to disharmony, chaos and disorder. Those who do that despite knowing the implications are anti-national and subversive.

In the recent past the Government has not taken action on such matters. That was why there appeared to have been rampant disregard for the sensitive nature of those matters, including instances of glaring disrespect for the Malay Special Rights, including defacing of the website of Sultan of Perak and blocking the path of the Raja Muda of Perak. The Sultan of Perak had advised on 14 June 2009 for the rakyat not to question Malay Special Rights as it is seditious. The time will come when the Government takes action in prosecuting more than just those who defaced the Sultan’s website.

Dot.

Anonymous said...

Rwi Hau,

You said, “haven't i sacrificed enuf of what i have for the country when i had to give up my rights for someone else's happiness? is that called FAIR and EQUAL?”

What exactly have you “sacrificed”? You “had to give up your rights” – but what right have you actually given up? Have you spent money or toiled for hours to help people? You call “giving up your rights for someone else’s happiness” when all you did was not wanting to accept the Special Malay Rights that give Malays, who were left far behind, opportunities for better education, for acquiring corporate wealth (which they didn’t get during British rule)? You are being nasty, aren’t you?

Do you realise that when you begrudge the Special Malay Rights, they can also do the same about your citizenship because the one was in exchange for the other?

You make a lot of accusations but do not explain or justify them with facts and figures. I have addressed your unjustified accusation of no equality in this country. When you complain about justice, you don’t even clarify what aspects you refer to – just a blanket kind of complaint. You don’t bother to say whether you meant justice in the judiciary, in the courts, in the Government. If it is in the Government, whether it is the staff, treatment of public, which department, etc. Of course, no evidence or substantiation put forward. It is, in your usual loose gun manner, simply saying there is no justice.

You said, “i dun think those supporting this campaign for the abolition of vernacular schools have tried to understand the most essential part of our nation building nor have they tried to understand why vernacular schools are that important to the non-malays.” What is the “most essential part of out nation building”? Why are “vernacular schools that important to the non-Malays”? Explain them fully, man, instead of just making loose statements.

Again you said, “those in support of the one school for all mostly go or went to national schools so they dun get the picture. get one person from vernacular schools to speak up here. we'll see whether they want vernacular schools to be done away or be kept.” The one person from a SJK© who wrote in up there did not speak of vernacular schools in glorified terms. So what next? The SSS promoters can produce to you several that are written in other blogs that confirm the problems concerning vernacular schools.

Then you said, “… for real, one school for all doesn't tell the true picture here. however, a standardized national syllabus is the real issue here.” If so, why must the standardized syllabus be pursued in the vernacular schools when children can benefit from mixing with the wider mix of communities there?

Then you raised the issue of discrimination in government service, saying “i guess the u haven't had ur share of being discriminated over and my best bet here is that u go out there and see for urself … suggest u come over and let me show you what a government department could do to the non-malays. juz exactly how many non-malays do u get to see working as a government officer or are government servants?” You ask readers to come with you for you to show what you mean when, writing in blogoshpere, you could have explained it. Without explaining, without showing facts and figures, you just, as usual, trigger-happily shoot. You don’t even indicate, let alone name, the department concerned.

You don’t have the facts and figures, do you? You just dare people to come with you to see because you know no one would. People are to believe whatever you say despite any substantiation with facts? Just because there are only a few non-Malays means discrimination in that department? Is that logic? What school did you go to and what kind of education did you have? Don’t shoot randomly, man. Be responsible with your gun, for goodness sake.

Dot.

TO BE CONTINUED IN PART 2.

Anonymous said...

PART 2

Rwi Hau,

Do you know that Malays apply for Government jobs because they do not have many chances of a career in the private sector which is dominated by the Chinese who control the economy? You don’t believe this, or you refuse to acknowledge, or you conveniently do not want to mention it? So, you have so many Chinese having private sector jobs and you still want Government jobs? Do you know what this is called? Have you heard people calling you and your type of always wanting more, more and more, without regard for others? What are you talking about?

Do you know how many from each community applied for the Government posts concerned? Do you know the selection criteria? Do you know the qualifications and consideration that have gone into the deliberation and the decision by the selection committee? I bet you don’t. You just rattle on, like you often do, saying you see so few non-Malays in a particular government department, so you conclude discrimination, ha? Rather irresponsible of you, isn’t it? So, by the same token, when people see so many non-Malay staff in private firms, that means discrimination, ha? What kind of logic are you using? As some one said earlier, I thought you were a University graduate. Graduates argue like this, ha?

Your profile says your are a student. You have not worked in any Governtment department and made your conclusion of discrimination just based on your visual impression. Come on la young man, you are 24 years old, you have to be responsible in stating your views. Don’t accuse; if you don’t understand, ask.

Do you know that the history of China is so full of rampant corruption since 2,000 years ago and so mired in endless wars, rebellions and killings that one Professor said that these have resulted in the Chinese attitude or culture of not being interested in working in Government service or in the armed forces? Do you know how many Chinese apply for jobs in the civil service or the Police or the Army compared to the Malays?

To find out the ratio of Malays to non-Malays applying (instead of just blabbering), you can write to the Public Services Department, the Police Service Commission or the Ministry of Defence Recruitment Division. I can guarantee you that the Malays greatly exceed the non-Malays. So, you say discrimination again everywhere, including in the Police and the Army?

Dot.

TO BE CONTINUED IN PART 3

Anonymous said...

PART 3

Rwi Hau,

I’m beginning to wonder whether I should continue to respond to your hardly thought-out and irresponsible statements. I know you will continue spewing the venom of your ill-perceived notions of “inequality, injustice, discrimination” and everything else that you feel like blabbering out. Or, they could be well thought-out and planned propaganda designed to erode public confidence in the Establishment to fit a hidden agenda you and your group have.

You don’t reply to questions about respect for the Constitution, about the position and the role of Bahasa Malaysia, you refuse to even imagine a Bangsa Malaysia talking the national language of this country. Hey Rwi Hau, you have to understand, respect and live by the principles of democracy that this country is committed to as reflected in the Constitution. Majority rule, in any issue. As far as the 1School proposal is concerned, the promoters are now calling for a referendum. They believe the majority wants it. Those who want to block or sabotage that call is not democratic. Those who do not believe in democracy and want to promote an undemocractic way of life in this country are subversive. They subvert the Constitution, the highest set of laws of this country.

Rwi Hau, the rational, peace loving, harmony- and unity-minded among your readers will see your true colour – divisive, ungrateful, uncompromising, no give-and-take, unreasonable. When you speak of giving credit to secret societies, thugs and gangsters like the Hai Sans and Ghee Hins, communist terrorists like Chin Peng and the Malayan Communist Party, you are, in fact, subversive. My goodness, you even want to change the national emblem! Quite a revolutionary fellow, aren’t you? I better leave it to the Police Special Branch to deal with you. I know they watch people like you because they are always interested in subversive elements. And it’s their job to maintain harmony, peace and order; they have lost a lot of lives, energy and effort to secret societies, thugs and gangsters, and the Malayan Communist Party, throughout the history of this country.

Read the proper history man, not wikipedia which keeps changing and anybody can change, and new information often not sourced to respected and internationally recognized authorities.

The time will come when the Police will act on people like you; they have already acted by arresting and prosecuting those who defaced the Perak Sultan’s website. They have also arrested and detained subversive elements under the Internal Security Act. When that happens, don’t accuse the Government of what you call “injustice”. That Act gives the Government the power to do so without bringing the culprits to court; you simply can’t argue and the law is very clear. It was passed by Parliament, democratically, and by majority decision. You might want to know that even the so called most democratic and most liberal country in the world, the US, also followed Malaysia; they detain without trial Americans and non-Americans in Guantanamo Bay.

The Police are very discerning and careful in using ISA; but if you are not careful and responsible in what you say, I won’t wish you luck on this.

Dot.

Rwi Hau said...

@anonymous - you explained a lot on the two types of malay boarding schools. the most important thing to note here is don't they segregate? i dun care if u wanna keep on explaining on those schools but i need to know aren't they race-preferential?
"""Malay boarding schools were designed to assist the Malays, who were left far behind economically and educationally, to catch up with the others in the field of education"""". if these schools are designated schools with their effective roles in assisting the malays, i juz dun see why vernacular schools cannot co-exist to assist the non-malays!!! u have indeed indirectly admitted that MCKK and MRSM do segregate!! no point in explaining that much on'em.

i bet u said rasing the malay boarding school issue is like raising the malay special rights issue stated in article 153. i guess u still haven't had the knock up of ur life have u? vernacular schools are guaranteed under the constitution now if u are fighting to abolish or questioning vernacular schools, can we charge u under the sedition act? isn't this called seditious as well? owh i guess then maybe u wud jump out and say this is for the sake of the nation bla bla bla. owh, when there's nuthin to do with the malays, it's not seditious, but when there's sth to do with the malays, it is seditious? cool. i like that flip flop.

i am indeed a student but that doesn't mean i dunno a shit about the country. owh, like you know a lot about the country? if i didn't know, i wudnt be here writing about it. u know it and i know it. i met so many students from the states. the first thing they asked was about our equality. if u think the states is that biased, u still haven't the slightest picture of what's called fair. i dun think u can fool me on this one apparently. the word race-preferential means JUSTICE? that must only exist in ur own dictionary then i guess. if u think all the chinese are rich, think again before u say it.

bahasa malaysia is indeed the national language. if u noticed(i bet ur too bz anyways), malaysian chinese address BM as the national language(Guo Yi), but chinese from the mainland address mandarin as their national language(Guo Yi). and still that isn't enough credit for ur BM? u want us to all go national schools whose history books are the source of ethnic cleansing? i bet u haven't read NST's 'whose history is our history'. you keep on telling people that BM is our national language. who doesn't know that fact? u still learn BM in vernacular schools which they call as national language. what else are u implying? that we should be doing away with our mother tongues and only have BM as our mother tongue?

i dun give a damn on what u depicted me as saying on the keris thing. had enough of exlaining done. there's no need to explain more to people like u.

the majority wants the 1school thingy? yeah rite when they couldn't even get enough ppl to sign it. hey anonymous, i really dunno who or where u r, but look around u. do those ppl look like they want it? u dun even have the balls to reveal ur own name. i dun think u have the balls to ask those around u.

if u think they detain those peopl at camp x-ray without trials, read again on who's being detained there. dun liken camp x-ray to ISA. i cannot tolerate stupidity and naiveness. political dissidents in the states are never detained because it is a free country. no wonder...

i never wanted any luck from u. thx anyways for the threat cuz all u can ever do is to threaten people. not scared. cuz u peol;e started it and tried to abolish vernacular schools. i haven't been so tempted to defend vernacular schools which are a guaranteed right under constitution. if u dun question it, would i be questiong ur righst? dun rile me.

faiz_0586 said...

this is what was written on the NST on april 11, 2009.

One Nation Shared Among Many People

Part 1
YEARS ago, when lawyer G.A. David Dass taught at Universiti Institut Teknologi Mara, he would be approached by students who would evince surprise that he was genuinely interested in teaching them and had no motives other than ensuring they understood the material.

He ventures that this was because they had been "conditioned into believing that non-Malays were not to be trusted and that our presence in Malaysia meant that they were taking something away from the Malays".

Dass believes that most non-Malay lecturers at UiTM have had similar experiences, in an example of how Malaysian history and how it is taught in schools -- and how it can be manipulated by politicians -- can graft lasting impressions on young minds that determine how they relate to others of a different community.

For years, Dass says, the non-Malay history in Malaysia had been framed by an ethnocentric elite as a story of how the Malays had "lost out", "been dispossessed" and "subjugated" by "bangsa asing" or "foreign races".

This narrative presumes that Malaya was "conquered" (dijajah) by Europeans eager to exploit its natural riches.

Control over who came into the land was out of Malay hands, and the penjajah allowed bangsa asing to enter and build their tin mines and rubber estates, while the Malays watched by the wayside in their villages.

Such a telling of history is warped, erroneous and, when it comes to the Indian experience in pre-independence Malaya, disingenuous.

It overlooks the contribution of Indians to local customs, culture, arts and governance. It ignores the fact that for 80 per cent of the Indians who came to Malaya in the 19th and early 20th centuries, their lives were shackled in deprivation and hard labour.

"How did thousands of mostly Tamil indentured labourers, who were paid pitiful wages and who toiled under the most back-breaking circumstances to open up plantations and build roads, dispossess the Malays?" asks Dass, who co-authored the book Malaysian Indians: Looking Forward.

Though the history of Indian contact with the peoples of Peninsular Malaysia between the 1st and 11th centuries is mentioned in school textbooks, its influence on Malay culture has been played down.

It is almost as if it is an embarrassment, says U.K. Menon, deputy vice-chancellor of Wawasan Open University, to acknowledge the extensive traces Indians left on local pre-Islamic culture which can still be seen.

faiz_0586 said...

Part 2
In The Malaysian Indians: History, Problems and Future, the late Muzafar Desmond Tate wrote of how Brahmin priests and Buddhist missionaries gave Malay chieftains the organisational system that would transform them into the kings of today.

But, Muzafar stressed, the early Indians' influence was not manifested in force of arms or large-scale migration.

When it comes to the later migration of Tamils, Telugus, Malayalees, Sikhs and Bengalis, there is a begrudging acceptance of their presence, notes Dass.

"They were not a colonising force to subjugate or rob the Malays. Many lives were lost in opening up these plantations and towns, and these Indians were indentured to the Europeans who brought them in. The point is to recognise each community's sacrifices that went into this great nation.

"Our founding fathers knew this was integral to nation-building."

His co-author, Jayanath Appudurai, says that the problem with how history is taught today is that it is seen through the lens of only one community.

"But the record shows that the peninsula was in a strategic position that attracted everyone from different regions of the world to converge and set up their own settlements here."

To acknowledge the various influences that went into creating what is now Malaysia is not to prop up one race or culture over another, Jayanath says. "It is not about the Indians being superior to the Malays or the Chinese being better than everyone else. It is about recognising the multi-ethnicity that has always been and continues to be present in the peninsula.

"It is about seeing Malaysia as a nation, not of a single ethnicity, but one of shared membership among many." -- SM

faiz0586 said...

Another article on april 11, 2009.
Go to http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Saturday/Frontpage/2528758/Article/index_html and have a look at the illustration, from page 130 of a Form Three textbook which gives the impression that vernacular schools cannot promote national unity.

Part 1
At last month's Umno general assembly, incoming party vice-president Datuk Seri Hishammuddin Hussein floated the prospect of revisiting how history is taught in the nation's schools. The suggestion immediately raised eyebrows among Umno's partners-in-governance, with the MCA pledging to convene a conference on the matter. CHOK SUAT LING, SHERIDAN MAHAVERA, SITI NURBAIYAH NADZMI and YONG HUEY JIUN explore what may have fallen through the cracks of this country's historical mosaic as it is presented in the school curriculum.

WHAT can and what can't be found in school history textbooks has been a source of concern for many years.

Besides omissions and insufficient emphasis on certain communities, experts and parents alike contend that some of the text and illustrations in history textbooks are placed there to subtly brainwash young minds.

Some of these elements contain politically-aligned and narrow views that can skew students' impressions of historical events and their impact on the country and its communities.

While school history textbooks now make a clear push for a national culture and society, are more comprehensive, and encourage students to be more analytical than in the past, when they were required to merely regurgitate facts and dates for examinations, certain elements in the texts must be reviewed.

In the Form Three textbook, for example, the contentious term "ketuanan Melayu", or "Malay supremacy", appears with a definition deemed inappropriate. Some quarters argue that the phrase should not have been included in the textbook in the first place.

In the same textbook, one illustration gives the impression that vernacular schools cannot promote national unity, and a paragraph on the same page states that vernacular schools will progressively be phased out.

faiz_0586 said...

Part 2

Also in the Form Three text, specifically in the chapter on cooperation among the races towards independence, the quote used to illustrate the theme states that the country belongs to the Malays and should, therefore, be returned to them.

These are just some of the elements that have found their way into history textbooks under the secondary school integrated curriculum (Kurikulum Bersepadu Sekolah Menengah).

Former Kelana Jaya member of parliament Loh Seng Kok thinks too much focus is given to Tamadun Islam, or Islamic Civilisation. "There was only one chapter in the old Form Four history textbook, but now five out of 10 are on this subject matter," said Loh, who carried out a study on history textbooks two years ago.

Loh, along with his MCA colleagues, submitted a memorandum to the Education Ministry pursuant to that study.

What has also been noted is the downplaying of the roles played by Chinese and Indian communities in the socio-economic development of the country.

Some quarters also take exception to the Chinese clans, the Ghee Hin and Hai San, which played so pivotal a role in the advent of colonial administration in the Malay states, being described as kongsi gelap or secret societies, abiding by the old British proscriptions on these organisations.

Specific historical figures such as Gurchan Singh, the "Lion of Malaya", and Sybil Karthigesu have all but vanished from the record. Both resisted the Japanese during the occupation of Malaya in World War 2 and paid the price for it. They used to get some mention, but have since disappeared from the pages of our history.

The key historical roles played by prominent figures from Sabah and Sarawak also merit little or no mention beyond "a line or two".

All Malaysian communities have their role in the story of how this nation came to be what it is today, and history texts need to reflect this shared ownership. Questions of ethnic relations in history must be discussed in scrupulously neutral language, without judgments of right or wrong.

A review would, indeed, be timely, but it must be collective, consultative and knowledge-based, not driven by emotion or political imperatives. -- CSL

faiz_0586 said...

New Straits Times, april 11, 2009. http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Saturday/Frontpage/2528812/Article/index_html

Interpreting the roles of non-Malay Malaysians

IN the 1930s, the British administration faced fierce opposition from the working class, largely made up of Chinese at the time, says Dr Kua Kia Soong, director of Suara Rakyat Malaysia (Suaram), a human rights organisation.

In one of the first shots at inter-ethnic political alliance, Pusat Tenaga Rakyat (Putera), a left-wing coalition of militant and moderate Malays, partnered with the Chinese-dominated All Malaya Council of Joint Action. In October 1947, the coalition organised a general strike -- a "hartal" -- that brought the country to an economic standstill to put pressure on the British government.

The Japanese Occupation in 1941 was met with fierce resistance from local nationalists. The British had supplied arms to the Malayan People's Anti-Japanese Army (MPAJA) -- in effect, the CPM -- making it the most potent anti-Japanese guerilla movement and well-organised military group in the country, writes Wong Tze Ken, associate professor in the Department of History, Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences at the University of Malaya, in the first volume of the book, Malaysian Chinese and Nation Building.

The move gave MPAJA an edge, and the means, to wage war against the British after the Japanese surrender in 1945.

"The CPM ideology and struggle had no place in the nation-building agenda as it eventually became irrelevant as the country moved ahead after independence," says Wong.

Prof Tan Sri Khoo Kay Kim agrees, as the vision of communism was one of classlessness and statelessness.

Under the gaze of a different generation, the joining of forces between the Malayan Chinese Association and the United Malays National Organisation -- the Alliance Party -- for the 1952 Kuala Lumpur municipal elections spearheaded the country's seminal independence movement. The Alliance scored a landslide victory, winning nine of the 12 seats contested.

That solidarity was a turning point, says Khoo. For the first time, the Alliance convinced the British that independence might actually work.

Dr Voon Phin Keong, director of the Centre for Malaysian Chinese Studies, thinks the subject of history is best left to the historians or specialists in the area. "It should not be left to just anyone. School history textbooks should be written by a panel of historians and subjected to review by a different panel."

Kua thinks textbooks are not needed in the age of the Internet. Instead, students should learn to access all available resources with the teacher acting as the facilitator in the classroom. "History in education is about uncovering the truth," says Kua.

faiz_0586 said...

this is what tan sri prof khoo kay khim has to say on the british policy of divide and rule.

""""Khoo does not have a problem with how history is revised in school texts to create a "Malaysianised" point of view, instead of the Eurocentric one that prevailed in the 1950s. "What is wrong is when you write and ignore historic facts," he says.

"The problem now is that if something in the Eurocentric view was black, it automatically becomes white in the so-called Malaysianised view. You must have proof to back something up."

Another example is how the textbooks say the British practised a "divide and rule policy", which ensured the communities were segregated, to breed suspicion and hostility among the races.

"There was no such policy by the British, and I challenge those who disagree to show me the proof.

"In fact, they tried to get the Malays, Chinese and Indians to integrate. It was the races who refused to do so."

Khoo laments that many textbook writers and history teachers these days have not even seen primary documents, such as the treaties signed between the British and Malay rulers.""""

can't trust what was written, go here http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Saturday/National/2534586/Article/index_html

Starship_Cobra said...

i cannot believe my eyes. people quarelling over SSUS here. i've read all the posts and this is what i can sum up.

to whomever concerned,

i agree with rwi hau. why bother telling people the agreement between the british and the malays on MCKK? anonymous was definitely telling us that this school does divide us. and he came up with article 153? hurm, i dont think that is a valid answer because anonymous himself hinted that the school is preferential. again i agree with rwi hau on what he put forth that the constitution actually guarantees the existence of vernacular schools in malaysia. questioning/pushing for the cause of its abolition is actually against the law. now, if you say that bill can be ammended, it would only mean that the special rights bill can also be ammended and erased from the constitution. funny huh?

many of our malay leaders had studied at MCKK. that is right. i agree with anonymous here. i think anonymous was implying that MCKK is a like a tradition and legacy to the malays. true. but does that mean the chinese leaders all graduated from national schools? and vernacular schools are not their legacy and tradition? hurm, anonymous dude, think about it hard. this has just bounced back on you.

The same goes to MRSM. for the record, i don't think anyone here touched about malay special rights. i guess mr. anonymous here was too sensitive or maybe someone hit the right chord? but take it this way anonymous dude. think again and put yourself in their shoes. would you be willing to give up what you have at the moment? changes in the constitution is somehow a matter of future. whether you like it or not, it will change because there was another anonymous dude who hinted the constitution would change somehow to suit the future generation. we do not know.

now, i have to dish it out to mr. anonymous who kept saying ghee hins and hai sans did not contribute to the nation building. someone made a point somewhere that the non-malays and bumiputeras of sabah and sarawak did not get enough credits in the national school history books. that is so true. i graduated from national school. i bet mr. anonymous here graduated from national school either. so, we know what's going on with our history. you can't lie about this. politicians have indeed been fooling around with our thinking.